Our First RV Accident -> Tow Comes Loose in NC
I’d planned to write a very different blog post today. We’d just finished a week on the Outer Banks of NC, staying in 3 different spots and I was going to give everyone a run-down of that.
It’s was a fabulous week and I’ve got lots to share, but sadly we had a towing accident just 2 days ago that damaged both our car and our RV and pretty much flung everything else out of my mind. Thankfully no-one was hurt and our immediate concern is just getting everything fixed, but it’s going to be a long road to get it all done.
Travel-wise this also means our plans will likely change again (arghhhh!), but we’re hoping we can stay close(ish) to our original coastal plans and that our faithful blog readers can maybe steer us to some good East-Coast repair spots. There are also lessons to be learned here, but I’m not sure we know all the answers (yet).
So What Exactly Happened?
We were traveling down Hwy 24 just outside of Cedar Point NC when Paul noticed something strange. Our tow car was behaving oddly and seemed to be swerving into the other lane. We have a rear camera so we think he noticed it almost as soon as it happened. This was a positive thing. Also there was no-one traveling in the lane next to us when the car swerved out, also a very positive thing. Honestly had our car hit another driver it could have been tragic, and it’s my biggest relief that didn’t happen. We have to be thankful for those two pieces of incredible luck, despite the material loss.
Now the less positive part.
Given we were on a busy freeway with an out-of-control tow our #1 priority was to get the car and RV off the road as quickly and safely as possible. So Paul did what he could to get to the side of the freeway and slow down in as controlled a manner as possible. This was not an easy task, especially given how freaked out we were and I give him full kudos for how well he handled it (I’m not sure I would have been as calm), but there was just no way he could prevent what happened next.
Since the car was only attached by one tow arm and swinging wild on the left side of the RV, as we slowed down it naturally smashed into the back left back end of the rig. We have a US Gear auxiliary braking system* on our car and my personal opinion is that helped to slow everything down quite a bit, but it just wasn’t enough to completely limit the damage. In the end the front hood of car was smashed-in, the left back end of RV indented and our tow bar bent was bent and is now unusable.
The good news is that everything did the job it was meant to do. The metal part of the car is meant to crumble in order to absorb the impact of a collision and our auxiliary brake is meant to slow the car. The collision was soft enough that none of the air bags deployed and we honestly didn’t feel a thing inside the rig. It could all have been much, much worse.
*Note/ We also have an emergency brake release cable on our car, but it didn’t engage. The emergency brake is there to stop the car in the event both tow arms fail and the car gets completely loose from the RV. In our case only one arm came loose, so the brake cable didn’t pull, the brake alarm did not go off and the car kept moving. All cables were still attached when we finally stopped.
How Did it Happen?
So this is where it gets interesting, so to speak. The way our bar attaches to the car is with a thick 1/2″ cross-pin that threads each tow arm to its respective attachment on the the base plate. The big cross-pin is then secured in place by a small cotter pin**.
In theory this is all fine and dandy. The big 1/2″ cross-pin is really what holds everything together and when your tow bars arms lock in their extended position it’s wedged pretty tight in there (when we unhook we sometimes have to pull pretty hard to get it out). So, the little cotter pin isn’t really under any stress and serves mostly as a fail-safe stopper.
But that’s also exactly where we “think” the failure happened.
There’s no way we can know for sure, but very likely the little cotter pin either somehow broke or sheared, or popped off*** allowing the big pin to slowly start working it’s way out as we drove the the bumpy, windy road up the coast. It probably took a while (many miles?) to come loose and if we’d been on a straight/flat road nothing might ever have happened, but once that big pin started slipping out the rest was inevitable.
One little pin = lots of damage 🙁
** POST-POST EDIT #1 – Several commenters pointed out my terminology is off here. What we had on our bar was not actually a cotter pin, but an R-pin or hitch pin. I will leave the post as-is, but wanted to add this as an extra note for clarity.
*** POST-POST EDIT #2 – Several commenters brought up the possibility that our pins were maliciously removed by pranksters. We initially hadn’t considered this scenario (at all), but I cannot deny this is a real possibility. We were stopped on the ferry for 2 hours giving someone ample time to tamper with our tow connections. And admittedly we did not check them after. Paul can’t actually recall if the other cotter/R-pin was there after we had the accident and removed the remaining arm (we were both too freaked out at the time to notice). But we can’t seem to locate the pin now and if BOTH pins were really gone then tampering is the most likely cause. I hate to think someone would intentionally do something that could endanger lives like this, but if so our conclusion of implementing more road checks (after every stop) would have caught it. This is definitely something we will change in our procedures going forward.
It’s Happened To Others Before Us
Amazingly it turns out we’re not the first folks to have this happen.
When I posted our accident to Facebook several RV friends immediately responded back that they’d run into exactly the same failure. The cotter pin on their tow-arm pins either broke or came off and the big pin started working its way out. Some people managed to notice before the arm completely detached, but others suffered quite serious damage similar to us. Knowing what we know now it seems like such an obvious weak point in the system. Why would tow bar manufacturers even design something like this?
Interestingly enough most of the folks that reported the same failure said they had older Blue Ox tow bars. Initially I didn’t pay much attention to that.
Roadmaster Helps to Narrow Down the Story
Now I have to say upfront that Roadmaster has been incredibly helpful through this whole ordeal. We made contact the very next day and they offered to help in any way possible, including complete replacement of parts. Their customer service and response has been fantastic. We discussed the accident, I sent them pics of the damage and that’s where it got interesting.
Turns out the folks who did our installation in San Diego (top-rated guys by the way) back in 2010 didn’t use all-Roadmaster parts for their install. They used a custom base-plate which is actually designed for Blue Ox bars. So, in order to connect our Roadmaster tow bar to their custom base plate they took off the original Roadmaster connectors and replaced them with Blue-Ox compatible connectors. So, what we actually have is a Roadmaster tow bar with Blue Ox-type connectors.
Huh??? I never knew that??!
We were total newbie RVers back when we got our tow bar and simply took our car to the best-rated authorized tow bar installer and paid for them to hook us up with a Roadmaster bar. We never realized they made modifications or used different parts for anything, and honestly we never thought to check it afterwards. Our contact at Roadmaster was actually at a loss to explain why they would use a set-up like this at all.
Is THAT Why Our System Failed?
No, but it did bring that cotter pin into play and made our whole system more prone to error.
Our Blue Ox-compatible connector is actually an authorized part made by Roadmaster. They make the connector for folks who already have a Blue Ox plate (say) on their car but for whatever reason want to switch to a Roadmaster tow bar. So, the parts are all totally legit.
But the connectors ARE visibly very different. The specific type of Blue Ox-compatible connector we have uses a simple cotter pin to hold the main cross-pin in place whereas the original Roadmaster connector uses a much thicker linch pin that wraps around and snaps (locks) in place. The way the parts connect are different too. Just look at these pictures:
This locking-type connection means it’s much more difficult for that linch pin to come off, whereas a cotter pin can potentially be popped off, given just the right trigger. The linch pins are also a lot heftier/thicker than a cotter pin. All the Roadmaster designs use this more foolproof set-up. All new Blue Ox designs (from what I can tell) also use these better locking/linch pins too. It now appears to be the industry standard.
So basically we just had an older (and somewhat unusual) set-up. It was an approved set-up, it was considered safe (as far as how it was installed and used), but it was simply more open to issues with that single cotter pin. One small failure point is all it ever takes.
What Happens Next?
We’re already working with our insurance company (Geico) on all the claims. We have both RV & car through the same insurer so that will hopefully make the entire process somewhat simpler. Also we’ve had our insurance for long enough that we have accident forgiveness (we’ve had Geico for over 10 years and neither of us has ever been in a auto accident) so our rates shouldn’t be impacted by the claim.
But of course it’s going to take time and lots of patience to get everything fixed.
Our car (Honda CRV) obviously sustained the worst damage. We initially thought it was only surface damage, but we took it to the dealer yesterday (just as a precaution), and it’s a good thing we did. Turns our our radiator was damaged and the car was not safe to drive. After some frustrating hours on the phone with the insurance company yesterday afternoon we managed to pull off the miracle of having an assessor come look at the car this AM which meant we could get the radiator fixed this afternoon. It all went seamlessly in the end, and the Geico assessor even cut us the check (minus our deductible) for the remaining damages already. Go Geico!
At least the car is driveable now, even if it still looks like a car wreck (sorry, had to put some humor in all this). From here on out it’s just body work.
The RV took much less damage from what we can tell, but the back-end is visibly dented. We don’t think anything internal was damaged, but we will take her in for a check at the very next Cummins shop we can find, just in case. Also the RV assessor is (hopefully) coming to see the RV in Charleston next week which will get that process moving forward too. Then we’ll need to find a good body shop to get her repairs completed.
Phew! I feel like I’ve aged 10 years in 2 days with all this. Much wine has been consumed….
What Could We Have Done Differently?
Whenever there’s an accident like this you always ask yourself the question “What could I have done to avoid this?”. An equally important follow-on question for my blog readers is “what can YOU do to avoid this?”. In the end there are things that we felt went right (and that we’re thankful for) and things we want to change…
The things that we felt went right:
- We Got Off The Road Safely: As far as handling the actual accident itself I don’t think there was much else we could have done. In a situation like this you just have to get yourself off the road and slow down as safely as you can and that’s exactly what Paul did. He kept a level head and no-one was hurt, and that is KEY.
- Our Auxiliary Brake Helped to Slow Everything Down: I’m a BIG supporter of auxiliary braking and I firmly believe our auxiliary brake helped to slow everything down and minimize the damage. Our car air bags didn’t deploy and our car damage wasn’t nearly as bad as it could have been. I absolutely recommend that every RVer who tows installs an auxiliary braking system. Seriously, just do this.
- Our Rear Camera Helped Alert Us: We rely on a slew of safety and check measures when we tow including our auxiliary braking system, our TPMS system and our rear camera. In this case the rear camera was really what alerted Paul to the issue. Without it we *may* not have noticed the car swerving so quickly. We’re very happy we have one.
- We Got The Car Checked: Although we didn’t initially think anything internal was damaged and the car was driveable we decided to get it checked anyway. It’s a good thing we did and I would encourage everyone who has an accident to do the same.
- We Took Pictures & Contacted Our Insurance Right Away: We took pictures of the car and RV at the site of the accident right after we got off the road. We probably won’t need them, but I felt it was important to have a record of the event just in case. Also we got the claims started the same day with our insurer which helped us when we needed to expedite the car repair the very next day.
The things that we want to change:
-
NO more cotter pins (that’s Pauls evil eye) NO More Cotter Pins: I was very impressed with Roadmaster’s support after our accident and am still confident in their tow bar. So we are sticking with the same brand of tow bar for our replacement, but we will definitely be switching to a design that does NOT reply on a simple cotter pin to hold the cross-pin in place. Although the set-up that we had was technically ok, it just seems like an awfully weak failure point and I would not feel safe using the same again. If you have a set-up that uses a cotter pin like we did my advice is to see if you can replace the cotter pin with a heftier locking/linch pin or padlock ASAP.
- More Regular Checks On The Road: It’s possible we could have avoided all this by implementing more checks on the road. When we first hook-up we follow a pretty rigorous process where both of us double-check each others’ work (4x check), so we know without a doubt that the cotter pins were firmly on there when we started driving. But once we start driving we generally don’t check again. In this case we took a ferry (we were stopped for a while) and then had some bumpy driving thereafter and admittedly we did not double-check the tow connections after either of those events. I honestly have no idea if this would have helped**** (we really don’t know exactly when we lost the cotter pin), but I think that getting into the habit of walking around the rig and doing a double-check of tow connections whenever you are stopped (or things significantly change) is a good idea.
**** POST-POST EDIT #3 – If our pins were maliciously removed while we were stopped on the ferry (as many commenters have suggested as a possibility), then this would definitely have prevented our accident. We would have noticed the missing pins right then and there and could have taken steps to secure our connections before we started driving again. Stop re-checks are going to become a permanent part of our routine going forward.
Any Tips On Good Body Shops?
So that’s really it. We’re fine, the pets are fine, and no-one got hurt. It’s really the best you can hope for in any road-related accident. But now we do need to plow through the pain of getting everything fixed while still living in our home. We are hoping to keep to the same general route south that we had originally planned which will take us from Charleston SC through Savannah GA and into Tampa FL, although we may have to do extended stops at one of those spots for the repairs.
If any of you know reputable body shops (both car and RV) in any of those 3 spots please DO comment below. Also if you’ve had a similar failure or experience (or tips) you want to share please do so too. I’m curious whether this has been a problem for others outside my Facebook RV friends.
I’m honestly, deeply hoping this is the last of our unexpected expenses & travel changes for 2016. It’s been a challenging year, but hopefully it’s all clear-sailing (clear-driving?) from here. All fingers and 12 paws crossed 🙂
POST-POST NOTE RE 2017 HEALTH CARE PLANS/ This is totally unrelated to the accident, but I wanted to let all my pre-Medicare blog readers know that you can now browse 2017 plans & rates on healthcare.gov (open enrollment starts Nov 1st). My initial and very quick perusal shows that not much appears to have changed for the “top 3” RV state (TX, SD, FL) since the post that I wrote about this last year. For SD there’s the same Silver Avera plan that we signed up for this year, and for FL the same Florida Blue plan from last year seems to be available again too. I’m waiting to see what RVer Insurance writes about this in a few days and will get around to writing a more detailed post myself once we get past all this accident stuff.
With only two months to go, here’s hoping the rest of the year is incident free! 🙂
Seriously…yes, please 🙂
MUCH more likely someone pulled the carter pin as the first step in trying to steal your tow vehicle at one of your stops. They then found to base pin too difficult to pull and gave up on the theft. As you drove the base pin, unsecured by the carter pin, managed to work itself out in response to the shifting dynamics of the tow.
Our only stop this particular trip was on the ferry where we were packed in tight with other cars (not possible to steal a car there), but there is still the possibility someone took the pin maliciously (for whatever reason) while we were there. I don’t like to think that’s what happened since I hate to think someone would do something like that, but I can’t deny the possibility is there. A re-check of our tow set-up (after we left the ferry) would have caught this, if that’s what happened.
Nina
Hey There. I just discovered your blog and I love it! I will be a regular reader in the future for sure.
A couple of technical things. First, your air bags will never deploy unless the vehicle is running and someone is sitting in the seat. Air bags need power to be active. Also, it’s certainly possible that the retainer pin did fail/shear and that caused the other one to be under a heavier load and also shear. It’s also possible of course that you had some random vandals/kids take out the pins, and I would definitely sub in locks now if possible if I was you, but it could also be accidental. The lynch pin takes most of the load but the retainer pins also receive significant side loading as the vehicle makes turns and moves back and forth subtly over many miles and they can just wear out.
Also, I used to be a claims adjuster (not for Geico but they’re ally pretty similar) and I would ask Geico where to take your vehicle. They can’t force you to go to any one shop but they definitely can recommend shops that they have relationships with and they will likely guarantee that shop’s work or at least stand behind the result more than a random one that they don’t work with regularly. Just my 2 cents.
Keep up the great blog! Very inspiring!
I have to admit that was my first thought as well. It’s highly unlikely the cotter pin would work its way out by itself. People do things that really do not make sense. It could also be kids messing with things for fun without any understanding of consequences.
I changed out my Roadmaster pins for padlocks immediately just to avoid tampering. I’m not really paranoid by nature but prefer to limit crimes of opportunity.
I’m so glad no one was hurt; either people or furry folks.
You know I can’t deny it’s a possibility. We were on that ferry for 2 hours and someone could easily have tampered with the connection and removed a pin. It’s horrible to think, if that’s the case, but you never know what people’s motivations are. I am certain we will be switching to padlocks now.
Nina
Have used an original Roadmaster Stowmaster for 26 years! My parents purchased it in 1989 and it’s HEAVY. Have it serviced by Roadmaster every year at their tent in Quartzsite. The techs always say it was Roadmasters first model which they built like a tank. Dad wisely changed the flip ring pins to padlocks, and I’m still using them. There are 2 short shackle locks that fit the huge (5/8″”) vertical pins and a long shackle lock that fits through and over the coupler ball lock. All three plus the receiver lock use the same key and are branded Schledge. Until your story, I used the locks to prevent theft of the car or hitch but never dreamed someone would be malicious enough to remove tow pins on purpose! As usual, your experiences teach us all valuable lessons. Thank you!
I’m pretty certain we’ll be going with padlocks on our new set-up. I like the extra safety of them, including the fact that thieves or pranksters won’t be able to take off with them (or the car) while we are hooked up.
Nina
So sorry this happened to you, but glad you are all fine! We had an adventure a few months ago in the middle of Ohio when I detected a different feel to our towing, and we discovered one arm of our Blue Ox tow bar had broken. Fortunately I was able to drive carefully to one of the amazing Ohio Turnpike Service Plazas with RV spaces available, and were able to have a new tow bar shipped to us in a nearby town. Blue Ox was amazing, and overnighted us the entire replacement tow bar for free! We were very fortunate, as we did not have any damage at all. I don’t have a specific repair place, but here is an idea. We are in the Tampa area, staying in Dunedin, at the Dunedin RV Resort (which is undergoing a new name as part of carefree RV resorts)–and the people here have been incredibly helpful to us. We are having a business meeting with a client flying in from Canada, AND we are then having a family get together here. So we needed to coordinate RV space as well as some hotel time too. They have a sweet little inn called The Blue Moon Inn (only 11 rooms) that are part of this property, with one pet friendly room. Room includes complimentary breakfast, and the rooms are spotless (numerous white glove awards for small lodging). I bet they could help you locate the best resources for your RV and car repairs–and this is a very nice facility as big RV parks go. Better than others we’ve seen in the area. There’s a small dog play area by the hotel, very close to the Pinellas Trail for walking, half mile to a Publix market, produce stand across the road, and 3 miles to Honeymoon State Park beaches where there is actually one dog friendly beach. Some nice restaurants too, and a small kitchen in the hotel room. So, you might want to consider this location for your repairs. Hope things work out for you! Travel safely.
What a lucky thing that you felt the shift, and good on Blue Ox for standing by their product and shipping you a new one. Cheers for the other tip too.
Nina
I didn’t have the same experience with Blue Ox. The connector bracket fell off of the arm and all that Blue Ox started was that cant happen andnI should have been having the hitch serviced annually by them. End of phone call. They did offer to sell me a $800 hitch for $1100 with a $100 good will discount which I didn’t take
Not a company that cares about their business
Very sorry to hear this. It’s a VERY different experience from the one we had with Roadmaster.
Nina
*big hugs* – what an ordeal the past couple of days have been for you. I bet it feels like years. My heart sank when you first posted the photos, and you guys have handled this in your usual stellar way. Thank you so much for sharing what you have learned in the process.
This morning, we switched out our locking pins for new ones on our BlueOx before we headed out.
We’ll be seeing you soon, and consider us at your service to assist in anyway we can in the upcoming weeks as you navigate this.
Oh my goodness, I can only imagine the heart palpitations you both went through with all of this. Relieved to hear all are safe, unhurt and the damage you’ve dealt with is fixable.
Hope you find quality repair centers along your path. Good luck and I will be certain to keep an eye out for the updates.
We definitely both felt pretty shaky after the accident. And it was a little hairy on the road too since there was really only a very small shoulder (so we couldn’t get the RV completely off the freeway). Thankfully a federal agent came along and stopped one lane of traffic for us so we could safely unhook the car and get back on the road. It was total luck that he was there (he must have been traveling only a few cars behind us), so I’m thankful for that too. In retrospect we had quite a lot of things go right when this happened, even though it surely didn’t feel like it at the time.
Nina
Whew, you guys sure have had your fair share of bad luck this year. Glad everyone is ok. Wishing you best of luck getting your equipment back in top shape and that your travels proceed without further interruption.
It’s been a loooooong year of many changes. I might be ready for Christmas a few months early this year 🙂
Nina
It is hard for me to believe that the cotter pin broke although I guess it can happen. I have been rving for almost 50 years and the few times I have seen similar things like this happen it has usually operator error. What happens is a person gets distracted while hooking up and forgets to put the cotter key in one side. Another thing is kids pulling pranks while at a motor home is parked and the occupants are eating or stopped at a rest area. I have used both type of tow bars and several different hook ups. with the road master tow bar that I had on the front of a previous jeep I used locks instead of cotter keys in all lynch pins. That way no one could steal the towbar or pull the pins without a lot of trouble. I now use a Blue OX tow bar and base plate and the tow bar is fastened to the motor home with a case hardened lockable pin. the tow bar folds up and stays with the motor home except when storing. I am glad no one was hurt and that both of you are safe and sound. BTW I use a check list and check my tow bar and toad when ever I stop. Force of habit from my flying days. Talking about getting distracted while hooking up. It happened to me. I had set the parking brake on a pickup I was towing behind a motor home. A fellow rver stopped to chat a minute and offered to help. I chatted a minute and forgot the hand brake was set on the truck. got in and started to drive away when I notoiced in the side mirror that people were running toward the motor home and waving. I was fortunate that I was on a gravel road because I had towed the pickup with the rear wheels locked for a good 300 feet. 2 nice furrows in the dirt and gravel. Operator Error.
Mel
We have a lock on our tow bar (where it attaches to the RV) but we’ve only ever used those simple cotter pins on our arms. I like the idea using locks there too in case someone decides they want to try and steal the car. Good tip.
Nina
What an ordeal! The only help I can offer is to take a look at rvservicereviews dot com for help getting the beast worked on. Oh, and we bought our CRV at Brandon Honda near Tampa and they treated us like royalty. Easily the best car buying experience of our lives. If we were in your shoes, we’d research their repair department and see if they match up with their sales people.
We asked the Honda dealer here about body work and they told us they don’t do it. Of course that could just be the local location. I’ll call the Honda guys in Tampa and see what they say. We’ve always had good service at Honda.
Nina
calling the Honda dealer and having them recommend a body shop nearby would be the best best for servicing the Honda
Yeah we did that, but interestingly enough the local dealer here didn’t have anyone they wanted to recommend. They said the local shops weren’t all that good and to look somewhere else. Finding good body work is always tricky.
Nina
In the past I’ve heard of two others that have had MH/tow car crashes. One involved a speeding driver that rear-ended the towed which in turn rear-ended the MH. The other was a case where he towed broke free and stopped when it ran off the road to the right of the road. In the second case, the owner did not notice the missing vehicle for a couple of minutes.
So far (knock on wood) I’ve only had one scare, I had a safety cable loop wear through, discovering it when we stopped for lunch. As a safety measure, every time we stop, I get out and inspect the hitch and tow brake cable and feel the tires to see if any are warmer than the others. BTW, I have a Roadmaster Sterling tow bar and the Roadmaster baseplate, we tow a 2006 CRV.
Eeeek….not fun stories. With our brake system we get a loud audible alarm if any of the brake cables come off, so I think we would have caught that second case right away. The first case is just really bad luck.
Nina
Please forgive me for changing directions here. Being cat lovers, I’m sure you will understand.
On 10/10 we took our cat Bri into the vet. She had been listless and had thrown up three time is the previous week, we knew something was wrong. The vet took some blood and did a T-4 sample. Her kidneys seemed to be off some but not unduly worrisome and the thyroid was fine. She got some anti-bionics and an anti-nausea shot and we brought her home. She ate well for several days but then would hardly eat her food even though she was clearly hungry. We took her back to the vet on 10/21. The vet did an ultrasound and came back with bad news. There were three lymph nodes that had masses in them and it appeared there was some additional spread. The vet took a fluid sample for further analysis but said it looks like lymphoma. Bri got an anti-nausea shot and we came home. Lymphoma in cats is always fatal. She ate well for the next several hours but the would just go to her dish, sniff, and walk away. Cheryl and I discussed what to do and it was clear. On 10/24 we went back to the vet. Bad News. The cancer was an extremely aggressive one. We did the humane thing right then.
We miss Bri terribly. There are so many rituals we have developed over the years and so many good times we have shared.
I needed to share this with someone and you are the people that most came to mind.
Thank-you for listening.
I’m so very, very sorry for your loss. It’s a terrible thing when we lose our furry family, and it hurts when it happens so quickly. My heart goes out to you 🙁
Nina
Check out ProTech in Charleston. They did an excellent job of putting an entire new roof on my Class C after a run in with a tree which ripped off the entire side of my roof. Plus, they definitely know how to work with insurance adjustors. I have Geico, too. They have years of experience and combined experience with the repair guys. They know what they are doing with RVs…they’ve seen it all. They could probably direct you to a good auto repair shop, also.
Excellent tip. I will look them up. Thank you!
Nina
So glad to hear no one was injured as a result of this accident and the damage is not too terrible. It sucks, but what a relief considering what could have happened. I too have noticed how thin those pins are and it does seem like such an odd design. We will definitely be double (and triple) checking our tow system from now on. Glad you guys are ok.
Thank you also for the note about the ACA plans. I had resigned myself to having to wait until next week to find out if we’d be able to keep our plan. What a relief to know we’ll still be able to get nationwide coverage (we have Florida Blue). I had been extremely concerned about what we’d be facing this coming year.
Best of luck with the repair process. Hope you’re on the road again quickly!
Yes, FL should still have a good nationwide health care option on the ACA for RVers in 2017. Right now it’s the only state I recommend for domicile for pre-medicare RVers who need individual health insurance.
Nina
Hello Nina. As a horseman and farmer I have and also have had employees lose trailers etc. The biggest single reason is R-Pins. THEY are not cotter pins as you refer to them. You can get lynch pins small enough to replace the R-Pins or clips as you may call them. Weeds and spring metal fatigue can cause them to fail. If you must use them then push them all the way thru and first chance replace them. Another common failure point is the big pin that the R-Clip goes in. They can wiggle and wear and suddenly shear off due to wear and fatigue. IF you tow you gonna lose something sooner or later. God bless that no one was hurt and property damage was controlled. Our RV travel trailer has been in the shop for 3 weeks to get the fresh water tank replaced so repairs seem to be at “southern ” time!
Good info and tips (and thanks for the correct name on those pins). I have to say I don’t think we replaced those pins often enough. We did replace them several times over the years, but I don’t think it was often enough. Thanks for sharing your knowledge on it.
Nina
Wow, scary! I plan to forward your post to someone I know who also tows.
I believe those are actually called “hitch” pins. Cotter pins are bent over after being inserted. I can see how if the pin were moving laterally during travel it could eventually “wear” through the hitch pin, but I would think you would notice that wear when hooking and unhooking before it failed. I think in retrospect I’d want an auto brake lock-up with one arm’s detachment, assuming that wouldn’t cause the other arm to fail.
I’d like to think we would have noticed the wear too, but as a material scientist I know that metal can suddenly fail if it’s been under enough constant flex stress (even if it’s not showing any external signs). It’s just flukey bad luck IMHO.
I’ve thought about the auto-brake lock thing you mentioned. The system we have isn’t designed like that and I don’t really think any tow brake system is. Auto-lock doesn’t happen unless the cables physically break loose which they didn’t do in this case. I’m also not clear that auto-brake on the car would have caused less damage. Maybe we’d drag the car causing the tires to overheat/tear and who knows what else? Perhaps dragging the car would cause more metal damage with the other arm? Hard to say really. Once one arm gets loose I think damage is hard to avoid.
Nina
Oh Nina! I am so sorry to read about this. We haven’t had damage, but we did have our Blue Ox base plates start to pull right out of the frame rails of the pickup truck. Fortunately we got home before the truck got away from the RV. We think it was improper installation, combined with the use of grade 5 bolts on the frame rails. We went to grade 8s and have had no further issues. That was our first in a series of five serious mechanical incidents – it was a looooong spring that year. Happy you’re all ok and it’s not any worse than it could have been. Hang in there.
Wow…potentially super scary. So glad you caught the plate pulling off before it became critical.
Nina
Thanks for the detailed report. Certainly glad it was no worse and no injuries.
We had an accident pulling out of a gas station last year and had the repair work done at an insurance recommended RV and big truck repair place near Augusta, GA and I would not use them again. They took much longer than they said, paint job was not what it should have been and communication was poor. Their online reviews looked good. Let me know if you want their name as a place not to use.
I’m so very sorry to hear that. Always deeply disappointing to get bad service like that. Yes, I’d love to have their name. It’s good to know the places to avoid too.
Nina
Cushman RV Appling, GA was not a good experience for us.
Thanks. Again, so sorry it was a bad experience.
Nina
Had the same thing happen to us years ago (with no damage) we felt very lucky. In thinking about it I really feel it was HUMAN error… I remember being distracted while hitching up the car and it is very possible that I FORGOT to put the cotter pin in….. So now I hold up my hand and ask people to talk to the HAND until I am done hooking up, if they continue to talk to me I IGNORE them until I am done. When I am done I explain WHY I chose to ignore they always understand……. Shame on me for not double checking. I am now retrained and WE BOTH double check…….
Glad there was no one injured and the damage was not real bad…… Safe Travels Lee and Shelia
Scary, scary and SO lucky that you did not have any damage. Paul and I have gotten into the habit of double-checking each others work. So, if one of us hooks up, the other double-checks the connections and then we both check again before we leave. Same with the exterior of the RV. We both walk around the entire exterior twice before we set off. If you travel in a couple, I think BOTH people checking is a great habit.
Nina
I was happy to read that no one was hurt, and that the damage was mitigated by your braking system. We moved from a cotter pin type system to a locking system a couple of years ago. I am so glad we did.
Hopefully all the repairs will go well and the RV and toad will look as good as new soon.
Yeah we honestly should have moved to a locking pin arrangement YEARS ago, but we just never knew or thought about it. I guess you don’t know what you don’t know until you do. Then, it’s obvious.
Nina
I drive for a living and have done so since 1994. It takes a good….no….a very good driver to keep calm in a situation such as this, quickly analyze what is happening and then to react properly. Well done Paul.
Totally agree. I really don’t think I would have stayed as level-headed and calm as he did. He did an awesome job.
Nina
We have a new Blue Ox with the newer locking pins and we still lost one but seen it before anything happened. We went to Blue Ox in Pender, NB and it was suggested that we put locks on instead of the pins which we did. It is a heavy duty lock and we don’t have to worry about anyone unpinning and stealing any of the equipment. After we left Blue Ox we did encounter a blowout on the front left tire so I know what you are going through with looking for reliable repair places. We are on our way to TX and if anyone know of a good repair place I could use one also.
Roadmaster offers padlocks for their pins too. I think that’s what we’ll go with when we fix the bar. I like the idea of a lock there instead of a pin (even a linch pin) that can potentially be removed.
Nina
So glad you are all ok and damage is limited to mostly body work. When I started to read this post, I was immediately interested in what failed, and how, since I tow a jeep. My Blue Ox setup has the linch pins, like the replacement you showed. But, I do not have the convenient cable that keeps the linch pin and cross pin together. I put that on my to-do list. I also like that you both cross check the setup. That is good and I think I will ask my DW to help with that. I use a pre-flight checklist religiously, since there are so many details that have to be perfectly right.
Best regards, and safe travels.
Oh Nina, I was so sorry to hear about your accident but thankful that no one was hurt. You certainly have had a stressful year. You are probably wishing to put 2016 behind you. Hope you are able to find a good body shop along the way and that the remainder of the year and beyond are nothing but smooth roads and blue skies.
Glad to hear only sheet metal and nerves were wrinkled. Being new to towing, on our first trip last year we were having trouble keeping the battery charged on the toad (4 door Ram 1500 pickup) due to an inline fuse blowing. On return from Florida, I would check the fuse at every stop. Just prior to Jacksonville we stopped to let the pups out at an abandoned gas station. While doing a check and walk around, noticed the “big” pin was 1 section away from separating from the tow bar. The linch pin had been there at the stop prior. I’m replacing the linchpins with locks, as soon as I can find ones that fit and are long enough. The next 100 miles all I though about was…..what if. I now check all connections at every stop and always will. I also picked up some tips from the comments section on the post. Love the blog, keep sharing, helps all learn.
Wow…such a lucky catch. And yes, the “what ifs” are the scariest thoughts. By the way we wired a fuse disconnect for our CRV so that our battery doesn’t discharge on towing. I don’t know if a similar set-up is availible for your Dodge, but you may want to check into it.
Nina
Oh my, Nina…you certainly have had your share of issues this past year, the pets medical problems, now this. We do thank you for sharing, to help someone else possibly avoid a problem.
I also wanted to share some info regarding insurance preMedicare. I worked with a broker through RVinsurance, Kyle’s site. I got a plan with FL address, nationwide coverage, free telemedicine, 3k deductible for major medical for $422 per month and I’m 62. Think it would be cheaper for younger adults.
The broker is Portia Lavigne, 497-687-1550. Please tell her I referred you. It was the best option I found that covered me nationwide & had the telemedicine benefit.
Very nice! Could I ask what company the plan is with? Was it off-exchange or on-exchange? We’re just starting to look at all our options now.
Nina
Wow, so sorry to hear about your pin failure. Glad that nothing more serious happened. Thank you for taking time out to educate us all further. I’ve got a BlueOx baseplate with those same cotter pins (and a crappy rusting tow bar & supplemental surge brake that really needs an upgrade). Your story is a wake-up call to get these items upgraded before it’s too late. Thank you!!! Hope your repairs go smoothly and you can fully enjoy Charleston– it’s such a charming town!
Yes, definitely replace those cotter pins ASAP (get yourself some linch pins or padlocks) and go get that bar serviced at a minimum (Blue Ox offers good service options from what I hear).
Nina
My nephew lives in SC, so I sent him a message. He got hold of a friend. His friend recommended 1st Choice RV in Charleston, SC (843)532-2120. He’s not sure if they do car repairs, but it may not hurt to ask.
Than you! I will check them out.
Nina
Don’t own a rig yet but I live in Sarasota, FL which is about an hour south of Tampa. Just outside of Tampa, in Seffner FL, is a huge RV dealership with over 200 service bays. I believe they do RV body work. Here is their website if you want more info. https://www.lazydays.com/rv-service/rv-collision-repair
As for auto body work, I have used a small collision company in Sarasota that does impeccable work. The quality of work was great, Might want to see if they can help you. The company is called Dynamic Motor Car, 5411 Palmer Blvd, Sarasota, FL 34232. 941-371-8844
Thanks. I’m familiar with Lazy Days and they’re on our short-list to check out. For the RV I think we’d prefer a dedicated RV body shop, but we’re open to what works best. Cheers also for the car body shop tip!
Nina
Frightening! We are preparing to get back on the road again, and this time we have a towed. I picked up a Jeep Liberty with tow-bar system all installed. Thus far I have towed it a total of 140 miles but your article has made me sure to keep a watch on the tow system on our trip to Arizona.
At any rate, sorry you had such a problem, hope all goes well with the the repairs, and you get back on the road soon. Just wondering, I am not all that great with this tow stuff, you said when you have the bars extended, do you tow extended? I thought you were supposed to tow collapsed? Not sure even on this, the outfit that sold us the rig didn’t give much education on how to set up and tow, they simply hooked it up for me and we were off.
When you first attach the tow bar the arms will be partially collapsed. But when you tow, the arms will extend and lock in place. That’s what they are meant to do. Most tow bars actually have a lock release so that when you reach your destination and stop towing, you put the car in park and “release” the lock so that you can more easily remove (and then collapse) the arms.
Nina
Sorry to hear about your accident. I just wanted to quickly stand up for Blue Ox. We have had the same blue ox tow bar for the last 12 years of full-timing and have towed our car over 200,000 miles. Our 12 year old blue ox tow bar came with the linch pins that you mentioned in the post that come with Road Master tow bars. We have been very happy with our Blue Ox. After reading your post it sounded a bit “harsh” against Blue Ox. It sounds like your installers simply used cotter pins instead of the proper linch pins.
Not meaning to come off brash against Blue Ox. My understanding, from my RV friends who had the same connectors and a similar failure to us, is that some of the older Blue Ox bars came like this with cotter (R-pins) pins on the cross-connectors. I looked at the newer models and they all seem to use the locking linch pins now, so that appears to be the industry standard. I think anyone can upgrade their cross-pin, even if they have a model that used the cotters/R-pin (I’m guessing, but that’s what I hope) which was really my main warning/lesson from the post. If you have a model with a cotter/R-pin, my advice is to upgrade it ASAP.
Both tow bars are good bars with a good reputation.
Nina
I love that in such trying times you think to share all that you learned as quickly as possible with as many people as possible. That’s generosity and the planet needs about 7 billion more of you.
HA! Thanks….sure makes me feel a tad better 🙂 Thankfully no-one was hurt and if our accident helps a few other folks get a safer set-up I’m happy with that outcome.
Nina
Try this place http://www.creativecoach.com/home.html , very good work, hookup provided. Once you’re out of Camp Parking Lot, Le Lynn RV Resort http://www.goodsamclub.com/travel/campgroundsandrvparks/generalinfo.aspx?cgid=890000120 is a nice fairly inexpensive place to decompress.
We were looking at those guys yesterday so I’m happy to get a personal recommendation. We had planned a longer stop around Tampa anyway so that may well work out. Thanks!
Nina
Not sure where you are in NC, but I traveld a ways from Va to have Kevin Dunn do restoration work on my camper.
http://www.completervnc.com/
So sorry you had to go through this. Good luck!
Oh, sorry, just saw the map. You’re too far east for CompleteRV, but keep them in mind if you are ever in that area as they are good and honest! Good luck with everything!
First of all I’m thankful no one was injured. I’ve heard a number of RVer’s having accidents recently. It’s amazing what the failure of a tiny part can do. Is it possible that someone may have pulled that pin when you were stopped? I hate to think that, but there are a few in our society that I wouldn’t put it past them. I have been trying to stop ever two hours when traveling and check the tires and do a walk around.
I made a similar trip on the east coast last year, only going North. I spent six weeks around Clark’s Hill Lake. Also I had my fifth wheel wheel bearings repacked and a brake inspection at Augusta RV. They were fair and got the job done in just a few hours while I was waiting.
Yes it’s truly possible someone pulled the pin either as a prank or maliciously. We initially didn’t consider it, but we were stopped for 2 hours on the ferry and the possibility was there.
We know for a fact those pins were in when we started towing, and at least one was gone when we had the accident (we were both pretty freaked out and neither of us can now remember if the other cotter pin was still there when we detached the remaining arm. We can’t find it right now, so It may well have been removed).
I’ve never thought of anyone pulling those pins before, but I can totally see this is a possibility now. So sad to think someone would do this.
Nina
So sorry to hear about your mishap and so glad that none of you were injured. All in all you were very lucky as things could have gone much worse very quickly. RV life is such an adventure. We just recovered from a small fire in our battery compartment. Took us 3 months to have the rig fixed. This was diffucult as full-timers. I can say life goes on after these things, all is good.
I would strongly recommend Alliance in Wildwood, FL. Prior to Monaco going bankrupt they were a company service center. They continue to have many techs from the old Monaco days. This is a very large facility with lots of experience and capability. They also have a nice rv park to stay at for free. An FYI on Lazydaze, unless you have purchased your RV from them they will charge you $45 per night to stay while they do work. I think this is crazy and decided not to go there for service.
Best of luck and safe travels
Great tip, thank you! I did not know there was a former Monaco center down there.
Nina
Wow too bad and I hope your insurance comes through.
One question: Don/t you have some sort of break away that put your toads brakes on. Our would have stopped the car.
Yes we do, but since only one arm detached the breakaway did not pull out, so the emergency brake never engaged. All our brake cables were still attached when we stopped.
Nina
Yikes! What a frightening experience! I can identify with the towed vehicle coming loose, though mine is a small trailer towed by a pickup. I had the trailer separate from the truck twice while driving. Both times, it was because the hitch had what we now believe are manufacturing defects. In both cases, no damage was done other than to my nerves. So sorry this happened to you.
Super scary, but very happy to hear the only damage was to your nerves. I dread to think what would have happened if our car had hit someone else. So thankful that was not the case.
Nina
Glad you are O.K……I’ve drilled holes in my pins and placed padlocks where the clips used to secure the pin…No worry about some dope pulling them out, or them falling out…
Best to you..
Upriverdavid
Good tip. That’s a super easy mod to make which will definitely make the set-up more secure.
Nina
One place I would check out is Alliance Coach in Wildwood, FL. It use to be a Monaco/Holiday Rambler Service Center and still has the mechanics from those days. When on the east coast, I get all my work done there. They also have free full hook-up camping while you get your service done.
Good luck!
Excellent tip and #2 recommendation for this place. I will add it to our list of places to call.
Nina
I also have a Roadmaster tow bar and Blue Ox baseplate. I purchased a Roadmaster Combo kit that provides Padlocks to use in place of the pins.
http://roadmasterinc.com/products/accessories/combo_kits.html
I like that kit. I think we’re definitely going with a padlock combo on our new setup.
Nina
Ouch! And as many have said, for sure glad no one was hurt!
We have very similar setup’s. With the US Gear (Like the Proportional Braking. And, the Cockpit Control to change/adjust toad braking force is a real plus. We usually run down the road on setting 5 with this coach. On extreme long own hills, I will sometimes set it up to 7. The other plus, is the ability to use the lever on the cockpit control when first starting off. Some of the times, not both sides of the Stirling bars have ‘Locked’ into place, especially when on a downward slope. By applying some braking force when starting off, via the Cockpit Control, it allow drag on the CRV, which keeps it from wandering too far one way or the other, before both arms are ‘Locked’.)
And we too had a pin fall out, in Portland traffic on Interstate 5. We were able to, along with much ‘puckering’ going on by both of us, to work out of the traffic and over to the side of the road in semi rush hour traffic. We had no damage to the coach, and or the CRV, but, we did have a bent arm on the remaining attached unit, and a ‘road filed down knuckle’ attachment on the one that had lost it’s pin.
OK, the pin. WE HAD A GOOD QUALITY LOCKING PIN. And I always double check that they are ‘locked and properly in place’ for we move out. (My wife Deb, Mom to Poppin’s the Wonder Dawg, also double checks our hook up before each departure.) Our lock fallen off, and the Pin had worked it’s way out. So we bought different locking pins. (We wanted locking pins, after a gent told us he was in a restaurant when he saw his CRV driving out of the parking lot, with his road and mountain bikes on back… Seems the thief had just unhooked the car via the cotter pins and cables, jumped in, and started the CRV up and drove off… (We keep our CRV locked manually, with a second key. But, a simple broken window would get someone into the vehicle, with a key in the ignition.).
About this time, we had a fellow Country Coach owner lose not only their coach, but also their Toad, to a fire. It was his opinion, that after about a minute of trying to fight the fire with his on board extinguisher, that he still could have safely unhooked his Toad and moved it away from the coach. BUT, it was ‘Locked’ on, and he kept his towing gear bag in a bay of the coach – that he could not approach due to the heat and fire…
So, what we do now, is use the half inch pins with the cotter pins. We place large flat washers (Home Depots or Lower.) on the inside of the cotter pins. They take the wear and tear, and shield the cotter pin.
And I admit, that we make a habit of watch the CRV more often as we sweep the gauges and the rear view camera. We made it a point of both helping each other to study the toad/CRV in our regular sweeps of the rear view camera. (But also admit that as time goes by, we’ve both probably slacked off on doing so…)
So what? Locking pins do fail (WE KNOW, AS OUR’s DID!). Cotter Pins do fail (We know, as I researched this before deciding to go with the Cotter Pins. Many suck posts if you search looking for this…). Failure of Cotter Pins with washers? Well, I’ve never seen one… Does not mean they don’t, but I could not find such a post.
And yes, different ‘kinds’ of Locking Pins. They all of course claim to be the best:)! The ongoing stress on these, and or Cotter Pins, from the dynamics of shifting forces – will likely make all of them at risk…
I feel better with the washers in the mix. I feel that the chance of fires is worth the risk of not having ‘Locking Pins’, for extra quick disconnect. I also feel that regular inspections of equipment, can tell you if you have evidence e of sharing on the pins. (Not sure if you could see this with Locking Pins?). And allow periodic and early replacement of Cotter Pins.)
And finally. STUFF HAPPENS! Not always, as many go 10, 20 or even 30+ years without any problems. It is so easy to get into a ‘Let’s hook up and go!’ attitude. (Getting a late start. It’s raining while hooking up! Getting distracted by others. Etc… )
Paul and you have been at this longer then we have, and I know form your posts, and my perception from briefly meeting you – is you both take safety seriously. So, let me repeat ‘STUFF’ happens. Move on, continue doing the best that you can at double checking each other on critical area, such as hooking up. Regular inspection of gear, and replacement of any critical component that is suspect. THESE ARE ABOUT ALL ANY OF US CAN DO:)!
Again, so glad no one was hurt. And get things fixed, and suggest you both call independently and talk to both Roadmaster/Blue Ox and ask specifically their recommendations for ‘Best pin securing methods’. (Nine times out of ten, suspect they will recommend a more expensive locking mechanism that they themselves manufacture. Vs a Cotter Pin, and or Ring. (And sure, a smaller Master Lock is also away to go. But again, it is ‘locking’ the toad to the coach… Which in case of fire, is IMO a negative.
Make your best decisions, and move on:)!
Best to you, an all,
Smitty
Thanks. Lots of food for thought there, and as you say nothing is infallible. We just do our best. Honestly hadn’t thought of the Fire scenario. We’d be more worried about our pets in such a case, but it would be nice to have the option to save the tow if we have the time. We have some more thinking to do.
Nina
Oh Noooo!!! I am so very sorry! But also so very relieved that no one was hurt! After having lived through the nightmare of “what ifs” when my hitch broke loose from my frame rail extensions, I know it’s enough to cause many sleepless nights! I guess I will quit complaining now when the linch pin “lynches” my fingertips when it snaps in place!
(BTW, I received notice that my Aetna plan is not in the exchange this year for TX, so it’s back to the drawing board again. GROAN!)
Kudos to you and Paul both for keeping your wits about you!
Gah, sorry to hear the health plans have changed again in TX. I didn’t look at the options there yet, so I wasn’t aware. I’m keen to see what RVerinsurance writes about all this. Their analysis should be up on their site in a few days.
Nina
A close call indeed and glad to hear you folks are alright. We have the same Road-master hitch you do and from looking at your pics and diagram we luckily have the correct connectors with linch pins. This is our tenth year using the hitch. Now here’s something that may be of interest. Years ago I read in a forum something that has stuck with me. An RV’er wrote in saying about kids have sometimes been known to pull one of the pins on a hitch assembly as a prank. Apparently it has happened. Since reading that I have tried my best to check those pins when returning to the rig from say Walmart, Cracker Barrel, McDonalds, etc. Especially important in the morning too when anyone walking by in the night could slip a pin out. At the moment instead of linch pins I have locks inserted instead mainly because it makes it a lot harder for someone to pull pins then steal our Jeep…………………A:))
Gosh, it really is possible those pins were pulled as a prank. I just hadn’t considered it, but it’s possible. We simply didn’t check our setup after our ferry ride, and we were stopped and in close contact with many others for several hours on that ride. That’s definitely a change we NEED to make. Required checks of our tow connections after each stop on the road.
Nina
If you notice on most travel trailers, that sort of pin/R-clip is the only thing holding the trailer to the tow vehicle….and it is only ONE pin, instead of two. If it comes out, kiss your house goodbye. Our fifth wheel hitch is secured to out truck bed with four of those; I will be looking into replacing them, Nina!
That is super scary. I had no ideas trailers only had one pin like that. We do have an RV friend who lost their trailer at a campground (thankfully at their RV site!) when their connection came loose. All that happened is their trailer rolled back in the site, but if it’d happened on the road it would’ve been much worse.
Nina
We have the Roadmaster Sterling tow bar now 10 years fulltiming with the Blue ox baseplate just like yours. But from day one we replaced the 1/2 inch pin with a key locked pin, I did not like the original setup and this works wonderful. Much safer, glad there was no major damage and no one was hurt.
So glad you guys are OK. Clearly it could have been much worse. Too bad you are not in Denver – I know a great body shop here.
Best wishes for safe travels the rest of the year!
Sorry about your accident. Thanks for sharing this experience for all to learn from. Connection of a towed vehicle or trailer is an often repeated exercise where one missed step can cause catastrophe. I have heard shared stories from others where it was thought in a prank someone pulled locking clip from a towed vehicle.
The hitch pin clip or R clip can get “sprung” with repeated use. Even when the clip is new and offers a tight fit, they never provide a positive, can’t fall out type fit. Your experience shows this type clip should not be used for this application. The lynch pin w/ ring clip is a much better suited for this application. The locking type pin seems like the best system. Positive lock and can’t be removed by mischief.
So glad the damage was relatively minimal and no one was hurt. The toad braking system did it’s job and big kudos to Paul for keeping cool to bring the rig to a safe stop.
Good luck with the repairs.
I totally agree. A locking pin or padlock is the way to go. Live and learn. Thanks for adding your thoughts.
Nina
Wow, the only thing worse is a tire blowout, which we suffered! SO we can make a GREAT recommendation for an RV/Car Collision repair place that is a GEICO preferred shop, will do the RV, Car and is pet friendly. You can park in a full hook up site right there for FREE while being repaired and it is very much in the central part of Florida, so accessible to Tampa and Orlando. It’s maybe 45 minutes to an hour to Tampa. It is somewhat rural but we ended up loving our three weeks there. The work is beyond the best! We’ve recommended it on RVillage: http://www.rvillage.com/businesses/recommendations/16170
And we wrote up about our repairs and all places we found to hike in the area. We used to live not far from there (Sebring) so we’ve seen all the sights except in Lake Wales, Florida. We wrote two posts about the area and showed our damage and repairs. https://thetumblelees.me/2016/03/02/lake-wales-florida-part-1/
AND it’s not far from a Camping World if you need much else.
The only downside is that is a very popular and somewhat busy shop. We had to wait there a week before they started. Then waiting for the parts was another week delay, but they did all our work in one week, so we were there for 21 days. Some people had reservations but it’s still busy. Their work start up time is 8:00 am.
It’s now our go to place if we ever need repairs again. But we hope we never had to go back as my mom has now moved so we really don’t have a family reason to go down there now.
Thanks! We will add your guys (Bryans Auto, Truck and RV Collision Repair Center, http://www.bryanscollisioncenter.com) to our list of possibilities. Always great to hear from folks with good repair experiences.
And yes, tire blowout is my other big fear. We do our best to make sure we check the tires and monitor them regularly, but there’s never any way to be 100% sure. Tire blowouts can happen.
Nina
OH MY! I’m taking deep breaths and trying to remain calm. You posted this the day BEFORE we are beginning our first day with Blue Ox 4 down towing after having used a very faithful and not so scary tow dolly for 6 years. If I’d read this even 6 weeks ago, I doubt I’d have spent the serious amount of money to buy all this stuff and install it. I am so glad you both handled this so well and that none of you was hurt nor was anyone else. Thank you so much for posting this so quickly and for all your commenters’ remarks. I’m sorry I can’t reciprocate not knowing any body shop places to recommend but I’m taking notes and worrying already. So many things that can go wrong it sounds like. With the dolly, all we worried about was a blow out on one of the back tires. I’m thinking now that might have been well worth the bother of the dolly. We too have had an absolutely horrible 2016 with medical problems, RV accident etc so I totally know how you feel about wishing this would all end PLEASE. We’ve had way more than the old saying” problems come in 3’s”. If only there had been just 3.
Honestly don’t feel bad about spending the money on a 4-down set-up. Both Blue Ox and Roadmaster make excellent tow bars and have very long (and good) reputations. RVers have used them for years with good standing. The kind of accident we had is really more of a freak thing than anything else and just a sequence of bad luck events.
My MAIN solid recommendation from all this is that if your set-up came with cotter pins (R pins) then REPLACE them with either linch pins or padlocks ASAP. Also I’d recommend implementing a tow-connection check after every stop. We didn’t do this after our ferry stop, and honestly if our pins were maliciously removed (as some other commenters suggested they might have been) we would have caught it then. Those are the two things we’re changing in our procedures.
Nina
No pearls of wisdom to impart, sounds like you have everything handled perfectly. I imagine the post was somewhat cathartic to “wrapping it all up”, and certainly an important reminder to all of us that stuff can happen out here. I’ve always been glad we have the hefty locking Roadmaster pins, but admittedly don’t check them when we make a rare stop along our route. We did buy spares for the just-in-case someone helps themselves while we’re out running around……Naturally the most important result is that no one was hurt and the damage repairable. Hope your repairs go smoothly and you’ll soon be playing with friends in the sunshine.
We’re definitely switching to those better locking pins (or a padlock), but given what everyone else has said about tampering, I think re-checking the connections (after every stop on the road) is an important step to add to the process. And yes, the most important result was that no-one was hurt.
Nina
So sorry to hear about your accident. Glad no one was hurt. One comment I have to make is we have been using Blue Ox baseplates and tow bars since 1995 and we never had a plain hitch pin, only a linch pin. We full time and put about 7500-10,000 miles a year on our rig towing our Dodge pickup, and knock on wood have never had a problem. We have heard of instances where either someone was trying to steal the toad or as a “prank” pulled the pin, but have never encountered it ourselves. We do make a point of checking the towbar and connections every stop we make. We might consider a lock, but wonder if the ability to disconnect the toad quickly in an emergency may trump the lock?
We can recommend Creative Coach in Lakeland, FL for the body work. They are an exemplary body and paint shop specializing in motorhomes, 888-234-3439. We have had some work done by them several times and were extremely pleased.
Excellent info and another recommendation for Creative Coach. That’s really good.
Nina
‘Really sorry to hear about this ordeal. ‘Must have really shaken you up. I know it would have me. I appreciate so much your detailed account and accompanying pictures. Lives may be saved because of the valuable info you have shared… Thank you…
Be safe!
I sure hope my post helps others. I really thought our tow set-up was as safe as it could be especially with our rather fancy auxiliary brake system, but turns out we missed an easy and rather critical upgrade with that simple pin. Don’t know why it never occured to us before.
Nina
Wow! Glad you guys are OK and no one else was hurt. The damage will be a hassle for sure but hopefully soon just a memory. Thanks so much for sharing this as it points out the issue of a partial failure that I never thought about much before. We’ve tested our breakaway by backing up the toad with only the safety cables attached to make sure the breakaway deployed, but that would represent a total failure. Your scenario is probably more realistic. Do you think if the toad brakes had fully engaged (or if you had some way to manually control them) that the damage might have been less? You can bet I will be checking my tow setup much more frequently now! In the Entegra forums I’ve heard mention of some well regarded body shops and will try and find that info for you.
I honestly don’t know if more braking on the tow would have helped or not. Our auxiliary definitely slowed everything down and we DO have a way to manually increase the braking power up-front (the US Gear braking system has that ability). Perhaps a little more braking would have minimized the damage? Perhaps too much braking would have been worse (car would have dragged and potentially spun out of control)? So hard to say. I think, all in all, we got off lucky.
Nina
Glad you are ok. We tow with a blue or system and we do not have that cotter pin. We have a post with ring that snaps down. It also looks like the large thick pin is different too. We just recently had an issue where the tow cable was not secured properly and had come off. Luckily we had a construction zone we were stopped at and a guy on a motorcycle told us we had a problem. It had shredded the entire one end. The hook and half the cable was gone. No other damage but a definite eye opener. I always do my once around inside…slides then in….then a once around on the outside. I had never double checked the cables…..until now!!!! So we had a $79.00 lesson learned. When we got to our next stop I ordered a new set from Amazon and they e delivered before we headed home!!!! Weren’t going to drive 1500 miles with one cable.
Anyways, good luck and happy trails!!!!
Good catch and good decision to replace the cable. Very happy no serious damage occurred for you.
Nina
So glad there were no injuries to you or pets! This has been a rough year for all of you. We just left Charleston, and are now on Tybee Island, Ga. on a positive note the island’s Pirate Fest is this weekend, ends on Sunday. Haven’t gone to it but the campground we are staying in looks full! That’s Rivers End Campground. Close spaces, and a small friendly place. Thanks for sharing about the tow bar system, we have the blue ox system, purchased in 2012. I am going to look it over now!
Hope the rest of your trip is uneventful!
Janet bickham
We had padlocks on 4 spots on our Roadmaster for the first 5 years of fulltiming. For the last year or so I removed the two on the locations where the pins are. Locks would get rusty or full of gunk. So we took those two off and boy is it easier to hook up the car. I do try to look at the hook up at most stops just to make sure that everything is Okay and that no one has messed with the set up. Also I look in the car to make sure no one is getting a free ride.
We have the flip down ring type pins and have never had one come up on its own but will keep a better eye on them now after reading your post.
God Bless and Safe Travels.
Rich
I do think the flip down rings are much safer than the simple cotter/R-type pins that we had. Much less likelihood of those popping or shearing off.
We are definitely going to be more diligent about checking both our tow connections and inside the car after stops. It just never occurred to me that anyone would tamper with something that could endanger lives like that. The results of a loose tow could be catastrophic, and I guess I don’t like to think anyone would be that evil. But we’re aware now and will not make the same mistake again.
Nina
Thank you for sharing this story. Glad no one was hurt. I’ve become way to complacent with respect to hooking up our new toad. The first thing I did after reading your story was to check to see if we had cotter pins. We don’t. We have linch pins which appear to be more substantial. We have a steel bumper on our 6 month old Jeep Wrangler which service as a base plate for the tow bar. We also have the new Roadmaster Aventa, their top of the line 10,000 lb tow bar. Our safety chains are much heavier than the ones we used on our old lighter toad. On top of that we have an air activated break-away system on our gas motorhome. A very expensive system that until reading your story I had a great deal of confidence in. Now I have to wonder and remember to take a very close look at everything every time we hook up as well as whenever we take a rest break. As we all know, the weakest link.
Yeah it’s hard to be 100% confident in everything. As another commenter wrote you just have to make your best decisions and go from there. Freak accidents happen even with the best-designed systems, and if someone tampered with our pins (as other commenters have suggested as a possibly) implementing an extra check after stopping would have caught that. So I think there’s some simple things we can do to improve our setup, even if we can’t guarantee that it’ll be 100% fool-proof. We live and learn.
Nina
As a truck driver, I usually check my 5th wheel release because that’s all that’s holding 60000 lbs of trailer from the tractor. You just never know. On the other hand, could that cotter pin break? I think yes and the reason is because that is a PIVOT POINT, unlike a TT hitch which uses the exact same half inch pin and cotter pin, the pivot point is the ball itself. Also, my cotter pins on our Travel trailer are brass colored- not actual brass- which means it’s heat treated and therefore much, much harder. It looks like from the photos that those “ring pins” or whatever they’re called, are also heat treated. My wife, Terri, who subscribes to your blog showed this to me so I thought I would share my 2 sense.
Thanks for adding your thoughts. Even though I’m more convinced now (thinking back on it) that our issue was caused by someone maliciously removing the pins, I do appreciate that they can also break. This is still a possibility and an important consideration for anyone who tows. No matter what, we are never using simple cotter (R-pins) for this purpose again.
Nina
Glad to hear no one was hurt. It is always scary when things happen while driving down the road. I wouldn’t have thought about someone messing with the hitch, but am surprised I didn’t immediately think that. When we were entering Yellowstone last year some young motorcyclists were weaving in and out of the traffic lanes and obviously weren’t happy with us being in their way and popped one of the bin doors open. Of course if it would have been locked like it was suppose to it wouldn’t have happened. Fortunately the car the bin door hit wasn’t damaged. But it was still scary that there are people in the world that do things like that.
Hopefully the rest of your trip and year will be smooth sailing.
It is not at all uncommon for people to tamper with Vehicles …When I started driving trucks I was taught to always walk around and check my rig after any time that I left it out of my sight even for a short time …People will often pull the pin release handle for laughs on your 5th wheel and if you are lucky it will fall when you drive away dropping the trailer on the ground…if you are less lucky you might lose it driving down the highway at speed…
It never happened to me but I always set my trailer brakes and pulled against the pin to make sure I was solidly hooked…Also I always locked my truck to make sure that no one could release my brakes when I was parked…Yes people actually do things like that …Always check everything…even lights…
I have the exact same setup as you guys. 2007 Diplomat with a Roadmaster tow bar and a Blue Ox tow plate on the 2013 Honda CRV. When I picked up my towbar from the factory, I ask Wayne which way I should put in the cross pins. He told me that their testing showed that if the cotter pin was missing, the cross pins tend to work outward, so I should always insert the cross pins from the inside and put the cotter pins on the outside.
I also heard the story, years ago, about someone pulling a pin as a joke, so I always check them after a stop.
I love the picture of Paul scowling at the cotter pin.
Awesome tip. I would never have thought of that, and it’s a super easy change to implement. Thanks for sharing that!
Nina
A second to Luke Alexander’s suggestion–on my Blue Ox set up, the cross pins always work to the outside so I insert the pins from the center out. Simply observe your cross pins each time you stop. If they always work to one side, then insert so the hitchpin, cotter pin or lock is on the side to which the cross pin has worked.
Honestly never thought of this. Such an easy little change to make and one we will definitely be implementing in our new setup. Thanks to both who commented on this.
Nina
Paul,
We met at Sault St Marie. We live in Charleston and the company that stores and works on our RV specializes in paint and repair work for RV’s. I have left a message with him and when he calls will send him your info.
We are still on the road, will be back in Charleston on 11/12.
Harmon
Oh awesome! Yes, please let me know if you get a contact. We are in Charleston now (just arrived today).
Nina
I’m glad the damage wasn’t any worse. I noticed you are at Cedar Point campground. You are 5 minutes from me!
Oh gosh! I had no idea we were so close. We’ve left now, but I wish we could have enjoyed the area more. It looked like SUCH an interesting place (and the campground was lovely too). Sadly we spent most of our time on the car and with the insurance company. We’ll have to come back!
Nina
Yikes, what a scary thing to have happen.
I have the Roadmaster tow bar with the Roadmaster hookups that use the lynch pin set up. Without a doubt it is more secure than just the cotter pin. However, in my setup there are additional large metal dowels with only cotter pins securing the bar itself to the frame. They are hefty pins though and seems like it would take a lot to break.
Also, since I have about 100,000 miles on my tow bar I had a shop in San Diego rebuild it last year.
Your re-build brings up an interesting point. There’s limited official info on the useful life of tow bars, but there’s no doubt they DO have a useful life and should be re-checked or re-built/replaced at specified intervals. Ours had minimal miles on it (less than 50,000 miles), so I definitely don’t feel it was a factor for us, but for those with older tow bars it’s a factor that should definitely be considered.
Roadmaster says 70,000 miles is a reasonable life expectancy:
http://roadmasterinc.com/products/towbars/life_of_towbar.html
This article has more interesting info on tow bar inspection/maintenance:
http://www.funroads.com/rv-repair/towbars/
Nina
So sorry to hear this, Nina. You guys certainly didn’t need another challenge this year. But so glad that you guys are safe and that Paul was able to maintain his “cool” in a scary situation. We have a TT, not a motorhome, but you can bet we’ll be checking to see what might apply to us here. You have likely saved a lot of people from accidents with this post.
Hi Nina,
If you guys are still in the area, you are welcome to “Driveway Surf”.
We are on Emerald Isle, couple of miles from your location.
Email for address if interested.
Charlotte
Oh how superbly sweet of you! We’ve moved on quite quickly. Once we got our car radiator fixed we headed south to our reservations in Charleston (we just arrived today). We have a week here so we’re hoping to have some more repairs done during that time. THANK YOU again for the offer!
Nina
You have received lots of food for thought. At the risk of any repetition, here’s my view…
For other types of towing, I have used the types of pins you were using. Through experience, I have found two things. One, after lots of use, those types of pins have a tendency to spread and become less than spring tight. Also, they WILL sometimes turn while moving down the road, such that they are upside down. If they no longer are spring-loaded, or if thru pilot error, they are not pushed on sufficiently, they will fall out. My sense is that this may have been what happened, as opposed to tampering…but who knows?
With our Roadmaster bar, we have the type that you show in your second set of pin photos. We will continue to use them and will not use locks for the reason stated about a fire, and for other reasons. But that’s just us.
If it were me, after the dust settles, I would assume the possibility of pilot error. Not because any body did anything wrong, but because it will cause you both to be SUPER cautious and check, double check and triple check. Don’t ask me what experience I have that causes me to make this suggestion. But the word “lots” comes to mind.
We are so sorry this happened, but you will soon be back nomad-ing with all this in you rear view mirror (camera), no pun intended. And your post is a definite public service. Thank you.
There is always the possibility something actually happened to the way the pins were installed. We’ve always been pretty cautious about our tow set-up (it’s always been a big fear of mine), but human error does occur.
Nina
Very happy to hear you guys and others are unhurt. Nina you should contact the ferry company and let them know what happened. There’s no way those clips popped out by themselves. You tow kit has been tampered with. The ferry probably has security cameras in the hold (homeland security and all that) and can hone in on the date and time you were aboard.
Worst case scenario is one of their employees is up to no good on board that ship. I’m sure the ferry company would like to know and get a police agency involved.
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Yeah, if I get my energy together this week I’ll contact the ferry company. It’s a smaller, open ferry so I’m not clear they’ll have camera footage, but you never know.
Nina
Nina, Paul as others have said thank goodness you weren’t hurt and the only damage was to things. They can be repaired. If you were coming to the Ft. Lauderdale/Miami section of Florida I would recommend A1 Body & Glass in Coral Springs. They are an excellent body shop and do work on everything from motorcycles to big Class A’s and all in between. They are Geico approved and have a Geico adjuster on site at all times. Don’t know if it will help but maybe.
Chuck & Debbie
Thanks. I’ve heard of A1 before (for RV windshield glass specifically), but didn’t know they did body work too. I’ll add them to our list.
Nina
Glad to know that you all survived the incident with no injuries.
When we purchased our 1987 Winnebago Chieftain, Blue Ox tow bar and US gear tow brake in 2004 we had heard stories over pranksters pulling safety pin as a joke with resulting problems and damage.
When we started towing a car in 2005 the first thing I did was to replace the ring type locking pins with padlocks on all attachment points (receiver, 4″ drop and the car clevis pins). I subsequently transfered the tow bar and Tow Brake to our 2015 Jeep Cherokee and Itaska Meridian combo. Thnakfully we have not had any problems such as yours. My wife and I work together as a team when hooking up and between us we have caught mistakes before we left the hook up point. After puttin away the hook up equipment i make a final check by doing a walk arround starting at the left front, down the driver’s side, arround the rear of the tow ed car and bak up the passenger side. As I do this I check that all compartment doors are closed and locked, the hitch is properly connected,pins are in and padlocked, safety cables,breakaway cable and umbilical are connected and that the towed lights or now light bar are functioning.
So far so good we have not had any problems with the tow bar etc.
Both of uss have enjoyed your blog and learned from it. Hope that you can continued for a long time.
May you always have Smooth roads, the wind at your back and a safe journey
Nice system of double-checks. We do a similar thing. In addition to checking each other’s work at the site, we’ll always do a final walk-around (check all bins, look underneath, check tow connectors, check antennas are down etc.) before we actually drive off.
Nina
Wow. Long story short we found out about cotter pins versus locking bolts. In our 45′ motor home in CA I saw the Honda Pilot tow not in the middle and horns were blaring to let me know the issue too! No braking system installed sadly. I had a huge Hydralift installed in the back of the diesel pusher so it impaled the Honda right up to the headrests. Missed the engine of Honda. Good. The Hydralift saved the Big rig. Good.We were advised that someone must have pulled the pins out of meanness or jealousy. However, we installed locking pins highly recommended by all. At the time we were newbies and just hope everyone installs locking bolts and have a braking system installed in tow auto!! We were full time for 4 years but had to return to brick and mortar due to some wife surgery needs and some family returning to the Midwest. Loved the life and will return part time! Glad you are safe
What a scary story and so glad the damage wasn’t worse. No damage to the RV is incredible. I can’t believe how many folks have commented with their own stories about pins being pulled. Really never thought it was such a prevalent problem.
Nina
Question? Do you leave your key in your car to tow it? If so maybe someone was trying to steal it and just got interrupted. Glad everyone is safe, it could have been so much worse, safe travels.
We do (key has to be in ignition in neutral during towing) but we were on a tightly packed ferry so there’s no way anyone could steal the car there. If someone had nefarious intentions it’s more likely they just removed the pins for the fun of it. I hate to think about it, but it’s possible.
Nina
Thank goodness you are both safe, and your pets, too. That is always the first thing. And it doesn’t sound like the damage is toooo bad, although even a little scratch can be expensive and time consuming. You must both be rattled, for sure. I hope all repairs are done quickly so you can get back to normal. I don’t tow, but appreciate you posting this in such detail for all my RV friends who do. Take care, and safe travels. 🙂
You have soo many comments…..Peeps looking out for you..A good thing!
Re the locks getting gunked up:..I put freezer bags over them with ties. I also bought a 3 pack of locks keyed alike and use the 1st for the hitch to my Winnie-bago. Also being a retired Teamster, there are (unpleasant) people out there who will pull the pins on 5th wheels..Semi’s or R.V.’s…Sad.. We just have to watch out for ourselves.
On air brake vehicles they will also switch the lines..Emergency and service, another thing to check for those with 5th wheels…
Enjoy the sun!
David
Good tip on the bags!
Really sad that malicious tampering of tow connections is so common. It boggles my mind, especially since I know how tragic the consequences can be. We will definitely be doing more frequent walk-arounds from now on.
Nina
I am certainly glad you are ok. After 10 years though, not too bad of a record to only have one accident that wasn’t your fault. I have a newer blue ox tow bar that has the retaining clips with the circular locks. Those things often get stuck to the point where I carry a little hammer in a back compartment to loosen them up when unhitching. I had been thinking of replacing them with a clip like Paul is holding up. Thanks to you, I won’t be doing that!
Believe it or not this is my first claim ever for a road accident (except for rocks hitting my windshield) since I got my drivers license as a teen. I’m glad we have car insurance even if it’s the first time I’ve ever had to use it for body damage.
Nina
Lots of great comments and suggestions and I can’t add anymore to it except to say glad you guys handled it really well and everyone on board is okay. I too would have aged 10 years had it happened to us.
For sure we will now be checking and double checking before moving on.
The year is almost over and I’d say you already had your share of challenges and you have overcome all of it. We will hope for smooth sailing ahead and you can breath easy and relax this winter under the Florida sun.
Glad no one was hurt, and a big thank you for sharing your story. We all learn from the events that happen to other RVers, I once had a pin maliciously pulled, but, thankfully caught it on the walkaround. Pin was there when I stopped in the evening, but, in the morning – pulled and lying nearby. Grrr
Wow. Clearly the pin-pulling prank is far more common than I ever would have imagined. So scary and so glad you caught it.
Nina
An Addendum to my earlier post.
Another reason for doing a careful walk around after each stop.
About 3 years ago friends were subjected to an attempted robbery. They were towing their Volkswagon TDI manual transmission. After stopping for fuel they drove for about 200 miles at the fuel stop a thief smashed either the driver or passenger side window and dislodged the gear shift from neutral into gear. The result was a siesed engine and a bill of approximately $5,000
Horrible story…and yes, yet another reason to do a walk-around check every time we stop. It’s a good lesson for us.
Nina
Another reason for doing a careful walk around after each stop.
About 3 years ago friends were subjected to an attempted robbery. They were towing their Volkswagon TDI manual transmission. After stopping for fuel they drove for about 200 miles at the fuel stop a thief smashed either the driver or passenger side window and dislodged the gear shift from neutral into gear. The result was a siesed engine and a bill of approximately $5,000
Ouch! What a horrible story. And yes, yet another reason stop checks are important. Thanks for sharing.
Nina
Nina and Paul,
Hello again, (we met at Elks lodge at Sault St Marie). I have not heard yet from Wayne at ProTech in Charleston to know if he still does body work. Will call again tomorrow. However, I would suggest that you contact Steve Corbin at Corbins. He does hitch work and is certified for all work and is excellent and can look at your car and do any modifications or repairs to the tow package that might be needed. He can also suggest someone to do body work. 843-747-3400. Waynes’ number at protech is 843-760-9933.
Harmon
Thank you, and thanks indeed for your efforts on our behalf! We SO appreciate it.
I went to another repair shop here in Charleston today just to get an estimate of how long it might take to repair the car and looks it will take 2-3 weeks (minimum). Apparently one of the internal support frames is bent which makes the job a lot longer than we originally thought. We won’t be able to stay here in Charleston that long, so we are probably going to have to delay the car repair until we can settle down for a longer stop Florida.
So, right now I’m looking to schedule BOTH car and RV repairs in FL. We have more time there and I think it’ll just make it all-around easier to handle. I was hoping everything could go quicker than this, but alas….
Nina
The photo of your connected tow bar gives an important clue.
In order to make the attaching of the cotter key a certainty, the key and the 1/2″ pin must become one unit otherwise it’s just too easy to set the little key aside, get briefly distracted then forget it.
I used nylon line to tie the key to the pin. They invariably become tangled up which was exactly the point. Once the pin was inserted the key must be noticed because you just untangled it plus, if not installed, it could not be misplaced but would dangle down in a very obvious manner.
Most likely? The key was simply overlooked.
We’re both pretty certain that the pins were there when we started out, since we do a double-check (each of us checks separately) when we hook-up the car, plus we do an extra walk-around and check before we start driving. That said I do like the idea of having a pin which attaches somehow to the main cross-pin. The Roadmaster linch pins are all like that (they have a wire connector so the two are never apart), and it’s easy to add a connector (like you did) to achieve the same result.
Nina
I had the szme thing happen. On a 10 mile drive to the storage yard, when i arrived snd started to unhook the toad, there was no clip. On mine it has a Torsion Clip (hang a ring that flips over to lock).
I either put it on wrong (it can fall out if installed wrong), or I just forgot thd ine side.
There is basically zero stress on this pin when towing. So my opinion is there was no failure, it was stollen or forgotten.
Glad you are OK,,
Dan
It’s looking more and more likely (as we think about this and read all the comments) that the pins were stolen/removed on our ferry stop.
Nina
Wow… how scary! So glad it all worked out. Hope there no glitches with the insurance. We have had a couple of close calls pulling our 5th wheel…keeping calm during those incidents are paramount! Also, my husband, like Paul are wonderful drivers!!
Hi Nina,
My wife and I just returned from our first RV adventure in Oregon and much of the itinerary was inspired by your travels and photos there–especially Joseph, the Painted Hills and the whole coast, from Cape Blanco all the way to Astoria. I see that you are now headed to Florida. We live in Orlando but also have a 700-acre ranch on the Peace River near Wauchula, a liitle over an hour from Tampa. We rent it out as a vacation rental when our family isn’t using it and while this time of year it’s booked most of the time on weekends, it’s often unoccupied during the middle of the week. If you and Paul were interested in seeing a little of old Florida that most people pass by, please let me know. No charge for you guys if you want to check it out and stay a few days. If you Google Peace River Valley Ranch, our VRBO site should come up. Thanks and I hope you’ll have your repairs taken care of soon without too much trouble!
Charles
Wow…absolutely awesome offer and we may well take you up on it. I will contact you personally if we do.
Nina
Terrible situation. There already have been many good suggestions, but here is one more. I’ve been towing our CRV for 30k miles using Blue Ox 1/2 inch locks (BX88101 on Amazon). They work perfectly and I’ve had no concern about them coming loose. They have an added security benefit. Since the Honda is unlocked ( it will not lock with the key in the accessory position) with the key in the ignition, it is nice to have the car locked to the coach. I also use two more locks to lock the tow bars to the receiver and the receiver to coach hitch. So far, no problems, no issues, no worries. Safe travels
I like the locks idea a lot. We’ve always had a lock on our main bar (where it attaches to the RV), but never used them on the cross-pins.
Nina
Glad this wasn’t any worse and that you are all safe and mobile. All long-term road warriors experience glitches and worse. You both handled this well. But then I don’t know how much wine was consumed, just to lighten the RV load of course. I’ve long had a grudging respect for the power of cotter pins even though they don’t always appear beefy yet will look into other options. You’ve helped us all learn through your misfortune. Good luck with east coast repairs. Can’t help you there. Here’s to more safety walk abouts for all.
No accident is a good thing but I am glad it wasn’t worse. Good luck getting everything fixed.
Very good advise on the walk around. Can’t be too cautious.
Wayne
Thank goodness you are safe and sound. We’ve had friends that had their 5th wheel come unhitched, due to a removal of safety pins – We always, do a walk around each time we stop, and take a special walk around when we leave the coach to go into a store or restaurant after leaving the vehicle unattended for just this reason.
Take care and may you be blessed with safe travels.
A loose 5th wheel is even more scary than a loose car! Hope the damage wasn’t too terrible for your friends. And yes, yet another reason to do walk-arounds after every stop.
Nina
Too many comments here to review. The only failsafe solution here is a lock and key solution which I have not seen mentioned.
http://www.trimaxlocks.com/locks/coupler-lever-locks.html
My blueox tow bar and base plate are held together by Trimax lock pins. this removes any chance of tampering or pins breaking and falling out.
You can order all different sizes with matched keys so any hitch related connections will have the same key!
Those are very nice lock pins. We’ll add them to our list of replacement possibilities. Cheers for sharing.
Nina
Sorry to read about your accident but glad that no one was hurt and damage to your vehicles was less than it could have been. Hope the repairs don’t delay you too much.
Think we’ll be replacing the pins on our towing assembly as soon as we resume our own travelling in January.
Safe travels.
Tim & Eileen
It’s looking like a 3-week job at the moment for the car. For the RV we don’t know yet. Wish it could get fixed sooner, but all this takes time.
Nina
I’m so glad you guys are okay! That must have been an extremely scary ordeal. I have the complete blue ox set-up and my cross pins are the thicker ones that clamp over and lock. Makes you wonder how some of these products ever pass safety tests. Stay safe and enjoy Florida!
As an RV/vehicle owner, your chances of needing the services of a collision repair and refinishing facility are greater than you think. Whether it’s from storm damage, rust and corrosion, acid rain and harsh sunlight, or an accident outright, the risks are real. It’s wise, then, to know how to select a body or repair shop.
Many times when people are involved in an accident they think “the insurance company will take care of it for me.” In fact, it is your responsibility to choose who will do the repairs for you. This is not a choice that should be taken lightly, as it can involve protecting a major investment.
I. Preliminaries
If you’re traveling, determine the city, town and dates where you’d like to get the work completed.
Ask your insurance company for a list of shops and contact information for that area. Since they regularly deal with repair shops, they should at the minimum be able to give you business names and contact information.
Ask friends and associates for their recommendations. Even in this high-tech era, old-fashioned word-of-mouth reputation is still valuable.
Check with your local consumer organization/Better Business Bureau regarding the reputation of the facility in question. Ask about the number of complaints, if any, and determine how the complaints were resolved.
Always try to visit the shop before making the decision on who will repair your RV/Automobile.
As a bonus to you, some insurance companies will offer lifetime warranties for the repair work you have done if you use one of their preferred repair shops. Be sure to ask if this is a benefit available to you. (Note: RV warranties may differ from Auto)
II. At the Shop
Ask if the shop customarily handles your RV/vehicle make and model. Ask how long the shop has been in business.
Ask if any of the work will be sub-contracted out. Keep in mind that the primary shop has little to no control over a sub-contractor and delays may be encountered. Different shops have different standards potentially resulting in quality issues.
Ask whether the shop carries fire and theft insurance. You want to be sure you’re covered if your RV/Vehicle is destroyed, stolen or burglarized. Ask if the business has adequate security safeguards in place. Ask to see where the RV/automobile will be stored while in the possession of the repair facility.
Be sure to obtain a written estimate and completion date for the repair work you plan to have completed.
0
Look for a neat, well-organized facility with modern equipment. Many manufacturers recommend specific repair procedures and equipment for the repair of their RVs/vehicles/equipment. Ensure that the facility you choose is trained in these procedures and has the proper equipment.
Professionally run establishments will have a courteous, helpful staff willing to answer all of your questions.
Look for signs of professionalism in the customer service area: civic and community service awards, membership in the Better Business Bureau, customer service awards.
Many times you can see the vehicles being repaired by the shop. Are you impressed by the type of vehicles the company is repairing and the way the vehicles are being handled?
Also look for signs that the staff is technically competent, such as trade school diplomas, certificates of advanced course work training from I-CAR (the Inter-Industry ASE Conference on Auto Collision Repair, and certifications—a national standard of technician competence issued by the non-profit National Institute for Automotive Service Excellence (ASE) or the RVDA-RVIA RV Service Technician Certification Program.
All policies, guarantees, and methods of payment should be posted or explained to your satisfaction.
The backbone of any shop is the competence of its technicians.
Thanks. We’ll make sure we check those items when we select our repair shop.
Nina
I found your chilling post on this just now due to a search on this subject because of my relatively innocuous but still chilling experience just yesterday with my Blue OX set up. I find that many people towing this way are unaware that it is only safe on paved (repeat PAVED!!!!) road surfaces. Gravel and dirt roads do not provide the right forces to always turn the toad’s front wheels correctly to follow around a turn. In fact, they can commonly turn to the opposite direction and lock in that position. The toad is then dragged with the front steering wheels dragging sideways. In a big motorhome, this is not always detected and the friction can wear down thru the tires and steel rims until discovered. Did I say chilling?
Anyway, yesterday, I was towing my Hyundai Elantra sedan/toad about six miles in Ft. Lauderdale to a repair facility for the standard timing belt/water pump/idler-pulley/seals replacement service that the small Asian engines require at about 60K mile intervals. Since my water pump completely failed, I towed it with my Ford Explorer, being sick of seeing the toad overheat and not wanting to chance it for even this short distance. I had the Avanta BlueOx tow bar on my Ford Explorer connected to the BlueOx base plate on the Hyundai. It’s all BlueOx with no mix-and-match.
I did not drive on a gravel/dirt road and would not because I know better. But I still got the chilling front steering wheel lock over in the wrong direction but fortunately only just as I was arriving at the garage and at only maybe 3 mph. I was making a 90 deg turn to parallel the road, all on good pavement, to get things straight and level for good disconnect positioning. Half-way through the turn the two car rig lurched to a stop. I was at a loss until I got out of the tow vehicle and saw the front of the toad; the front steering wheels were locked into the extreme wrong direction. Again, this is all on good pavement, but I did notice a little, narrow, almost dried up, three foot long or so puddle thru which I made the turn.
I am theorizing that this almost dried up narrow puddle on good black-top with the dry pavement on both sides was just enough to throw off the proper steering forces on the tires such that the reverse direction was forced.
I’ve flawlessly towed with this BlueOx rig for hundreds and hundreds of miles . But this one time experience, thankfully at very low speed, does give me considerable pause. What if it would have been at highway speed? Now I’m scaring myself again but “what if??”
Some years ago I started out towing my toad with a dolly. It was definitely a more stable rig with overwhelming positive steering due to the leverage of the dolly tongue. The towing four-down depends on much weaker steering forces via the small contact surface between the rubber and the road and as stated above, can end up turning the steering wheels in the wrong direction for potentially disastrous results.
Like many others, I got sick of dealing with a third many hundreds of pounds vehicle, i.e. the dolly, and opted for the four-down configuration for all of the common reasons. But now I am taking a whole new look at dolly vs. four-down, especially if I ever have enough courage to be doing toad pulling again!
The bottom line is that even on a good paved road the reverse-steering lock-up can occur when towing four-down. Is the small but existing chance of this happening worth the risk at highway speeds?
See FAQ #16 here: http://www.remcoindustries.com/Towing/FAQ.php
or quoted from the above link (Remco Industries site) here:
“#16
Can I tow in thick gravel or sand?
Yes, but be extremely careful! Sometimes the front tires on your toad will turn in the opposite direction you are headed and you will be dragging the vehicle through the sand or gravel. The only way to prevent the dragging once it occurs is to get out of the Motor Home and turn the steering wheel in the towed vehicle in the direction you are heading.”
Very scary story and very good info. Thanks for adding the link too.
Nina
Our tow set-up is pretty much the same as yours – we have a Demco tow bar but Blue Ox connectors. We use Demco Locking Pins (https://www.amazon.com/Demco-9523068-Locking-Pin-Kit/dp/B008OJ6XAA/ref=sr_1_cc_6?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1478019510&sr=1-6-catcorr&keywords=demco+pin) as they pretty much eliminate any concerns about theft. Now all we worry about is losing the keys! Good luck with your repairs!
Those look like great options. Cheers for the link.
Nina
We jus t finished having some very complex electrical issues fixed ( caused by lightning strike we think) at Alliance Coach in Wildwood Florida. Can’t vouch for the body shop, but they were very thorough with our repairs. We spent 6 weeks there (yes!). Decent little free campground with good wifi. Good luck.
Another good recommendation. 6 weeks is a long stay and electrical issues can be most tricky to solve. Glad they took care of you!
Nina
Glad you all are ok. Have read all the comments, such a statement of the regard you all are held in, what a two-way blessing!
Sidebar comment since you’re heading to Tampa Bay area. If water activity is part of your agenda might want to google news of recent St. Petersburg sewage dumping in ocean. Thought to mention as a poster also mentioned Honeymoon Island for a visit. I was living near there til recently, and even that far north has had a high fecal bacteria level warning. Hazardous warning signs (if any) that I’ve seen will not mention the word ‘sewage’, rather will say “due to high water runoffs…” Such a polite phrasing. I know some who swim anyway and some who are leaving the area, to each their own, be aware that’s all.
Thanks for the warning!
Nina
Glad you are safe and no one else was hurt. That’s the main thing. Rich and I were traveling in a MH towing a jeep when the same thing happened to us. We almost went off a mountain road–the S turns put too much stress on the tow bar, I think. I don’t know for sure–just very happy that it didn’t pull us off the mountain.
Just recently, in Colorado, some prankster or someone who needed a part stole part of my hitch to the trailer, when I stopped for lunch. Like you, I do a thorough check before leaving, but learned a lesson. Check often and especially if you leave your rig unattended for any amount of time. Fortunately, the trailer stayed on and no incident as I traveled another 75 to a 100 miles in the mountains. I couldn’t believe my eyes when I saw that the part was gone when I went to unhitch. Another camper at the RV park told me that there had been several incidents of pin pulling and unlocking of 5th wheel hitches in the area. Equalizer sent me the bar. Unfortunately, there’s no way to lock it so I will be sure to check it more often as I drive and for sure if I leave it for any length of time.
Just horrible! I have to admit my eyes have been opened to this kind of tampering in a way they never were before our accident. I can’t believe how many people have reported that it’s happened to them. So glad nothing happened even with 75-100 miles of driving after (so lucky!). Thanks for sharing your story.
Nina
Wow, that was a close call!
Not sure if anyone has mentioned Alliance in Wildwood, FL. Here’s their link: http://www.alliancecoach.com
We visited full-time friends there while their coach was being serviced and they we blown away by the service and knowledge of the staff. Ongoing issues that seemed unresolvable at other shops (including a finicky heavy slide and related damage) were dealt with expertly, and they have hookups onsite. We’ve sent a few other people there as well; fortunately, we’ve never had to use them, but would in a heartbeat.
All the best, and happy(er) trails!
Joanne
We e had a few recommendations for the shop. Great to know so many people like them. They’re definitely on our list.
Nina
The RoadMaster base plate is quite ugly. I am planning on using the BlueOx base plate with the RoadMaster towbar just like you and will definitely learn from your experience
We have a blue ox tow bar. I now wish that we had bought a Roadmaster as they have a feature that allows easier disconnect if the towed is at an angle to the rv (turning left or right) or if the towed is at a different horizontal angle (t.v. on flat ground but towed angled up or down). With the blue ox these situations can be a real pain.
Ever since we bought our class c I have been paranoid about checking:
1. Towed is in neutral (yea, I killed the engine in a towed Dodge)
2. Towed emergency brake is off
3. Steering column is unlocked
4. On a Nissan Frontier pickup – disconnect the battery! On an early trip with the Frontier the pickup computer engaged the brakes for miles. Cost us $2,100 to fix the brakes. The Nissan users guide was useless where it described 4-flat towing.
5. After every stop check all components of the tow bar system.
Like most cars, my steering column is unlocked for towing when the key is in the Accessory position. This same key position also enables my radio. I am so paranoid that the steering is unlocked that I turn on the radio for the whole time I am towing. The sound of that radio when I close the toad door is the reassurance that lowers my paranoia! It takes very little battery power. It’s worth it to me. No radio sound, no towing for me!
I will second your comments on the sometimes difficulty with disconnecting the BlueOx system when the cars (or is it stars) are not in just the right alignment. In addition to jockeying the whole rig back and forth into just the right relaxed position, I carry a hammer and punch to knock out the pins should I not be able to pull them out.
Also BlueOx recommends (I called them on this) rotating the steering wheel to extreme left and right in the toad to inch it into a relaxed position. No matter what, I still don’t like having to deal with stuck pins and the work-around’s. So I go out of my way to find a dead-level spot and then align the two cars along their center-lines, coasting to a stop. This works more often than not. But when it doesn’t….
Hi:
Key lock tow pins are only answer. After 10 years of travelling. From day one, I locked the pins with Blue Ox keyed pins. Never an issue with tampering. Easy to check when refueling. Even key lock the tow bar pin. Just replace every 5 years to be sure.
Cheers.
How about a threaded pin and nut with a cotter or R pin
The large cross pin has to be capable of some movement as the car bounces up and down on the road. At least that’s my understanding of it. So I’m not clear a threaded cross-pin would work? I do think that just securing the cross-pin with a padlock or linch pin will do the job.
Nina
Really sorry for the mishap you had and scared me as I have the same setup, Blue Ox base plate and a Road Master tow bar. I ordered the base plate based on what The RVGeeks had when they had the Blue Ox tow bar and was going to order the same tow bar until they switched to the Road Master tow bar. So I have the conversion connection with the small pins and cotter “R” pin also. Just got the https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00C5STXSK/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 that look like the Road Master pins, but fit the Blue Ox connection. We are just venturing into the RV world this year and sooo much to learn. Thanks for all your blog post that help us newbies get educated!
I have a Blue Ox tow bar and when it was installed it came with clip pin similar to the your new ones only with out the metal cable. I had one clip come out or I did not get in correctly and the large pin was half way out when I pulled into our driveway. Now I use a zip tie to hold the clip pins in. I have done that now for 10 yrs. And always do a walk around TWICE before moving each morning and at any stops. WE REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR BLOG.
Good tip on using the zip ties. A very easy method to secure the pins. Cheers for sharing.
Nina
Sorry for your misfortune. Thanks for the most helpful post and reminders. I haven’t read the many responses so this may have already been mentioned, but we use locking pins that prevent malicious unhooking. One more option…
Wow! Sorry for the malicious damage. Something similar but without the bad consequences happened to us. We stopped for lunch in Visalia, CA a few years ago and high school kids were wandering past the rig. After lunch and returning to the rig, I spotted a spring loaded lynchpin missing while looking over things before taking off! It’s a good thing that I keep extras! Some of the proper spring loaded lynchpins are hard to find! We already had locking hitch pins and padlocks for some lynchpins. Two of the lynchpins on our rig are cabled and can’t be substituted with padlocks. Trouble makers are out there. I have kept padlock and pin keys with the car keys and the coach keys for both my wife and me (don’t forget to add these keys to your spare key stash as well). So far we haven’t been locked out. Glad you have better pins on your rig now. There still is no substitute for doing a safety check after every stop where the rig is unattended. Little hassles. Keep on enjoying the big picture! Cheers!!
Any recommendation on what locking pins to buy or where? Thanks
That must have been a mess to deal with, good thing its over with now!
I agree I was extremely disappointed with Blue OX
I have been using roadmaster 576 all terrain tow bar for 15+ years and I must say the Roadmaster 576 is the best gift I’ve ever given myself! If you are using an older tow bar assembly I highly suggest upgrading. I wish I had done this sooner. This tow bar has an 8,000-pound towing capacity. It is made of stainless steel and aluminum. This particular model of Roadmaster really impressed me. As its name suggests, it works well with any kind of terrain.